|
Post by Bob on Jun 2, 2013 10:30:37 GMT -8
The matches are simmed and updated!
Quick note to Fleck: Duncan has played defender every game, so he should've had 4 before, not 5. So now he's at 2.
Note to everybody: Just a reminder about format. Please specify your team formation now since I have a prompt asking about it. Your teams can now change their formation VERY easily, so just do something like Juice did. His output was ALMOST perfect. He wrote his like this:
World Class Creatures = WIDE
Umaro = BENCH Boko = RF Quina = LF Chupon = C Stilkzkin = LD Ultros = G Cait-Sith = RD Red Xiii = BENCH
The ONLY thing I would've liked more was if these players were in the exact order as your team's input line. So since WCC is like this "WCC=World Class Creatures:Chupon|Stiltzkin|Umaro|Quina|Red Xiii|Ultros|Boko|Cait-sith" I would've preferred to see Chupon first, then Stiltzkin, then Umaro, finally ending with Cait Sith.
Wyvern: Your output was good, but I don't need the stamina. Nice to provide, but when I'm trying to think "Okay, Goalie is...umm...2!" I don't need to see 5 - Hojo because that makes me want to push 5. Otherwise, almost perfect like Juice's.
If you didn't give me much to go on, I just kinda looked at last round. So Count: I hope I got your teams right. I didn't know if the Seifer-Jecht swap was with Round 3's line-up or your default line-up? I just used everything you had for Round 3, but swapped Jecht in where Seifer played. Hope that was right. Look at Juice's example up there. That format helps me out tenfold.
Thanks, guys! Next match simmed...I dunno. Wednesday evening sound good to everybody? Let's shoot for that, unless there are objections. Blitz on, ya'll!
Also: how 'bout that TM vs. Loveless? A THRILLING first half, then a total clusterfuck in the second. I still need to work something out for when teams get clustered like that...
EDIT: And as a quick caution to teams as we enter our fifth round. If you've played the same Center and Defenders all five games, they'll ALL expire after this game, making you ineligible for Round 6. Read through Fleck's upcoming Stamina report and make sure your team fits. I know my Thieves are a bit boned next round, but hopefully they'll still be able to take down a team of GIRLS. GIIIIIRLS!
|
|
|
Post by wyvernxk7 on Jun 2, 2013 10:39:22 GMT -8
Quick sidenote - has anyone noticed that no goalie has ever stopped a shot that still had 12 points or higher once it reached him/her? I don't recall a single instance in the files I've looked through, and the cutoff is almost always 11. If it's 11, they'll get a hand on it, if it's 12, no can do. I assume that this has to do with the goalie's max CA stat being 11, but if we've got random bonuses coming in, how could the line be so consistently drawn? My notion: CA bonuses aren't working. Perhaps you can tweak the output to show the goalie's CA at the time of impact to show if it ever manages to get a boost.
|
|
|
Post by Bob on Jun 2, 2013 11:13:08 GMT -8
Hmm... Good observation. Maybe I'll include that output and we'll see.
|
|
|
Post by Fleck on Jun 2, 2013 17:52:31 GMT -8
Team Stamina Week 4Grizzly Bears NOTICE: ORLANDU MUST RESTForward: Dr. Kadowaki -7 Forward: Zangan - 4 Center: Orlandu - 0 Defender: Duncan- 2 Defender: Auron - 2 Goalie: Tellah - 9 BENCH: Galuf - 10 BENCH: Sazh - 10 Thieves 'n Mercs NOTICE: AMARANT MUST MOVE, LANI+GAFGARION MUST RESTForward: Amarant - 2 Forward: Ba'Gamnan- 3 Center: Gafgarion -0 Defender: Lani - 0 Defender: Locke - 8 Goalie: Rikku - 6 BENCH: Yuffie - 10 BENCH: Paine - 10 The Mad Experiments NOTICE: DELING MUST RESTForward: Mikoto -5 Forward: Julius -3 Center: Deling -0 Defender: No. 288 -8 Defender: Odine -8 Goalie: Hojo - 3 BENCH: Xande's Clone -10 BENCH: Kuja -10 The Nightshades - NOTICE: MIRA MUST MOVEForward: Mira -1 Forward: Blank -7 Center: Illua -2 Defender: Cissnei -2 Defender: Chime -2 Goalie: Frimelda - 6 BENCH: Reno -10 BENCH: Xu -10 Sublimely Magnificent 7 Forward: Jecht -7 Forward: Laguna -4 Center: Balthier -2 Defender: Edge -2 Defender: Cid Highwind -2 Goalie: Edgar -6 BENCH: Seifer -10 BENCH: Snow -10 The Magic Missiles Forward: Selphie -4 Forward: Vanille -4 Center: Garnet -2 Defender: Yuna -2 Defender: Aeris -2 Goalie: Lulu -6 BENCH: Rydia -10 BENCH: Rinoa -10 Loveless - NOTICE: TERRA MUST RESTForward: Lightning -7 Forward: Genesis -7 Center: Terra -0 Defender: Marche -5 Defender: Hope -5 Goalie: Vivi -6 BENCH: Sabin -10 BENCH: Cecil -10 Guests Who- NOTICE: LEO MUST MOVEForward: Lebreau -5 Forward: Edea -7 Center: Minwu -8 Defender: FuSoYa -6 Defender: Leo -1 Goalie: Olan -5 BENCH: Larsa -10 BENCH: Alma -10 STRAW! Forward: Bikke -4 Forward: Gau -5 Center: Freya -8 Defender: Fang -8 Defender: Barbariccia -5 Goalie: Celes -2 BENCH: Steiner -10 BENCH: Beatrix -10 World Class Creatures- NOTICE: QUINA MUST MOVEForward: Boko -5 Forward: Quina -1 Center: Chupon -8 Defender: Stiltzkin -8 Defender: Cait-Sith -5 Goalie: Ultros -6 BENCH: Red Xiii -10 BENCH: Umaro -10 Fleck's note: I hope everyone's getting the hang of this. I see a lot of moving around, so that's good. And just a heads up, Count, but Magic Missiles are on the verge of exploding. If you play next game in this formation, you'll have 5 people with 1 or less stamina, which is about as bad as a situation can be . Also, Bob, I am as confused as confused can be about how you want team formations listed. You keep doing this thing where your example has the two "Bench" players split first and last, and then the code itself starts with the center. I'm teh confused.
|
|
|
Post by Bob on Jun 2, 2013 20:52:16 GMT -8
Okay, lemme clarify, if I can. Note that this is the World Class Creature Roster according to my teamdata file:
WCC=World Class Creatures:Chupon|Stiltzkin|Umaro|Quina|Red Xiii|Ultros|Boko|Cait-sith
It starts with Chupon, then Stiltzkin, Umaro, Quina, Red Xiii, Ultros, Boko, and Cait-sith. THAT is the order you list the players. It's the order that the program asks me what they play, so I'd prefer to read top to bottom. The positions themselves can go straight to hell. To hell, I say! I made the positions line-up on my 10-key. I know left forward is 4 because it is the front row (4-6=front row) and it is the left (1 and 4 are left, 3 and 6 are right, 5 is center, 2 is goalie).
So if I read: "Chupon = B" then I know to push 0 (for bench). Next it'll ask about Stiltzkin, so in my fantasy, the next player listed will be Stiltzkin. When I see: "Stiltzkin = LF" I push 4 for Left Forward.
I changed my mind from how I wanted it early in the season--sorry about the flip-flop, but in execution, players need to be moved around constantly, so outside of Round 1, the whole "123456" input idea was out the window in favor of "1...4...3...wait, I meant 5." It was taking me too long to remember that left forward was 1 (or was it 2?), so I swapped it for a more intuitive key alignment.
Does that make more sense? We just started moving players around too much, so I'd prefer this route. I can just read a list and know, without looking, where the number for LF and G and RD are, just by where my fingers rest. Kind of a home-row keys situation for the line-ups.
Also: What do we do in the situation where players have no stamina to play their position? I could build in a function to like, cut all stats by a certain percent maybe? An outright forfeit would be kinda lame, but I dunno.
|
|
|
Post by Fleck on Jun 3, 2013 0:19:10 GMT -8
Okay, that makes more sense. I already sent you next week's team builds for Loveless and the Guests, but I'll try to arrange it better in the future.
We briefly talked about having substitute players when a team ran out of stamina and couldn't play/bench enough people, and the subs would be absurdly weak, but this might be more complicated than I originally thought.
I think we should do an automatic forfeit of the game, BUT the team regains all stamina after their forfeit game (since all the players have "rested"). So it's a big penalty, losing a game outright, but it allows the team a chance to recover without us having to mess around with extra programming.
|
|
|
Post by Bob on Jun 5, 2013 16:29:01 GMT -8
Will sim matches later today, but still need a Juice. If he doesn't reply, I'll probably just stick a random person in for Quina, so hopefully we hear from him soon. Still has a couple hours though.
|
|
|
Post by Bob on Jun 5, 2013 22:17:22 GMT -8
Wyvern: In coding the goalie thing you mentioned, I remembered that I actually purposely removed the Goalie Bonus. I mentioned it SOMEWHERE in our giant debate thread, but it was probably underneath a bunch of crap, or maybe some butt-coptering got in the way, but the point is, I eliminated it. The problem was that all defenders essentially had the same CA as the goalie, so there was too big a spread between randomly picking a defender or a forward. Forwards have a CA of like, 3. Defenders have a CA equal to the goalie, generally. There was no real diversity among the teams, so I decided that since it seems like goalie CA is working on its own and CA was given to all defender packages, we just said no goalie bonus. Sorry if you designed teams to use it, but it's gone. After this league and subsequent tournament, we'll decide if any tweaks need to be made.
On that note, 3/5 matches have been simmed! I'm waiting to see if Juice pops on to sim his matches, so I'll give him an extra day, but I shall post those matches tomorrow! Bwa ha ha ha ha!
And on the news of those 3 games. SHIT. JUST. GOT. REAL. Our league standings have danced around a bit. Can't wait to sim the Juice games so we can get official standings, but rankings have just taken a turn.
On the Thieves 'n Mercs game...I'm actually just glad we held in there. That whole team relies on Gaf, I've realized. I'm really looking forward to a good level-up session with that team because I NOW know what I want their team dynamic to be, but it's too late to adjust that now, dammit!
|
|
|
Post by Fleck on Jun 5, 2013 22:57:45 GMT -8
NEVER blame the butt-coptering!
|
|
|
Post by Bob on Jun 6, 2013 19:43:29 GMT -8
JUICE! LAAAAST CHAAAAANCE! Hurry and get your stats to me, otherwise I'll randomly replace Quina and otherwise use your defaults! I'm dying to sim those last couple games! The Grizzly Bears have a chance at a tie for first place with a win here! Come onnnn Grizzlies!
|
|
|
Post by Bob on Jun 6, 2013 22:16:57 GMT -8
...I meant tied for second. SECOND place. I knew that last night, but not earlier today. Anyway! All matches have been simmed. Sorry to skip over your picks, Juice. I hope this doesn't throw you terribly behind in everything, I just need to keep up the pace, which means allowing other people enough time to make their picks for next round, so we're moving right along.
Gotta prepare for the next match, which I'll sim either late Saturday or early Sunday. Looks like those Thieves are goin' against the new top team! Best part of this season now (over half way!) is that we're far enough in that it isn't enough for one team to WIN, but other teams need to LOSE. Now everybody (except SM7...so Count) is going to root for SM7 to LOOOOSE! Mwa ha ha! Everybody wants my Thieves to win now!
I'm too lazy to look up my own Stamina, but I wonder how my Stamina is doing. I'm glad the Thieves made it through with a tie against MAG because they were kinda up the creek without Gaf. But screw those guys! The GRIZZLIES! That's where it's at!
....More of you guys need to talk on here. I feel like a dick being the only one that's all cheering on my dudes and booing all other teams. But then, I guess if the shoe fits...
|
|
|
Post by Fleck on Jun 6, 2013 23:37:00 GMT -8
Team Stamina Week 5
Grizzly Bears - NOTICE: DUNCAN MUST REST
Forward: Dr. Kadowaki -4 Forward: Sazh - 7 Center: Zangan - 2 Defender: Duncan- 0 Defender: Galuf - 8 Goalie: Tellah - 8 BENCH: Auron - 10 BENCH: Orlandu - 10
Thieves 'n Mercs - NOTICE: BA'GAMNAN MUST MOVE
Forward: Rikku - 3 Forward: Paine - 7 Center: Ba'Gamnan- 1 Defender: Yuffie - 8 Defender: Locke - 6 Goalie: Amarant - 1 BENCH: Lani - 10 BENCH: Gafgarion -10
The Mad Experiments - NOTICE: HOJO MUST REST
Forward: Hojo - 0 Forward: Kuja -7 Center: Xande's Clone -8 Defender: No. 288 -6 Defender: Mikoto -3 Goalie: Julius -2 BENCH: Odine -10 BENCH: Deling -10
The Nightshades - NOTICE: CISSNEI + MIRA MUST REST
Forward: Reno -7 Forward: Xu -7 Center: Blank -5 Defender: Cissnei -0 Defender: Frimelda - 4 Goalie: Mira -0 BENCH: Illua -10 BENCH: Chime -10
Sublimely Magnificent 7 - NOTICE: CID MUST REST
Forward: Jecht -4 Forward: Seifer -7 Center: Laguna -2 Defender: Snow -8 Defender: Cid Highwind -0 Goalie: Edgar -5 BENCH: Edge -10 BENCH: Balthier -10
The Magic Missiles - NOTICE: AERIS MUST REST
Forward: Rydia -7 Forward: Rinoa -7 Center: Selphie -2 Defender: Vanille -2 Defender: Aeris -0 Goalie: Lulu -5 BENCH: Yuna -10 BENCH: Garnet -10
Loveless - NOTICE: HOPE MUST MOVE
Forward: Lightning -4 Forward: Hope -2 Center: Genesis -5 Defender: Sabin -8 Defender: Cecil -8 Goalie: Vivi -5 BENCH: Marche -10 BENCH: Terra -10
Guests Who
Forward: Larsa -7 Forward: Edea -4 Center: Minwu -6 Defender: FuSoYa -4 Defender: Alma -8 Goalie: Lebreau -4 BENCH: Leo -10 BENCH: Olan -10
STRAW!- NOTICE: BIKKE MUST MOVE
Forward: Bikke -1 Forward: Gau -2 Center: Freya -6 Defender: Fang -6 Defender: Barbariccia -3 Goalie: Celes -1 BENCH: Steiner -10 BENCH: Beatrix -10
World Class Creatures- NOTICE: BOKO MUST MOVE
Forward: Boko -2 Forward: Red Xiii -7 Center: Chupon -6 Defender: Stiltzkin -6 Defender: Cait-Sith -3 Goalie: Ultros -5 BENCH: Quina -10 BENCH: Umaro -10
Fleck's commentary: As we break into the second half of the season, fatigue begins to set in and every team except Guests Who have to bench or move a player. So far, positioning has had a noticeable effect on final results, so making bad lineup choices in these last four games could be costly. I know Loveless has suffered for not playing their best players in their best spots for both the Thieves and SM7 games, a mistake I hope not to repeat.
Although I've been invested in the season so far, there hasn't been much cause for me to really say anything about my teams, but if Bob wants bonus commentary, then he shall have it!
Don't be discounting Loveless just because they've finally tasted defeat, Bob! They're still sitting comfortably at 3rd and more importantly the new top two, SM7 and Grizzlies, are due to face each other in round 8, which means one or both of those teams are guaranteed to not get the full 2 points for victory. If Loveless can hold on until then, they're in great position to muscle into 2nd, or back into 1st, depending on how the last four games play out.
And the Guests have ditched the Wide formation netting them their first win of the season! Although they are currently out of playoff position, might I direct everyone's attention to their 18 goals this season? If position was determined only by goals, they'd be in 3rd. Granted, much of that came from their shootout with Straw! but the Guests are hardly a pushover, and I'm betting on them to scratch and claw their way back into playoff contention in the next few games. An upset against the Grizzlies or Nightshade could turn the season around for them.
|
|
|
Post by Bob on Jun 7, 2013 6:48:42 GMT -8
I really do enjoy the stamina system. I wouldn't mind re-examining the numbers behind them, but I really like that optimizing the teams is important. I think the Thieves would be SLIGHTLY higher if I'd had a better line-up against the Missiles, but then again that's not certain. But I lost Gaf, my only good forward, and Lani, my best defender/tackler.
I do wonder if the numbers could be better though. I think forwards are a bit crunched, plus it's hard to see them on the bench with 1 instead of 0. I wonder if it'd be worth looking into a number like 20 for Stamina or even 48 or 60 just because they have so many factors (and scaling a few numbers up, of course). And I think the Center position is too exploitable. It gets 5 games straight instead of the 3 a forward gets and it is basically the same effectiveness as a forward. Anyway, to be considered in the future.
Back on point though, I do enjoy Stamina. I'm finally getting my teams on track. Both teams are much more balanced and I understand their dynamics more. Plus, it's really fun trying to rearrange teams and predict where people will put their forwards and such. Try to shut their power forwards down with a good defender or two. And always good for the bits where you play the Great Vizzini deciding where to put people if you know the other team is trying to shut you down.
I'm surprised that the Missiles have been such a thorn in both my teams' sides, despite only having six goals this season. SIX! And I tied against them with BOTH of my teams! Missiles! *shakes fist*
I think the Wide formation is a bad idea, but I wonder if my plan to possibly have shots blocked based on people being on-near the path of the ball will help the Wide formation? Especially since I'm thinking that for fairness's sake, it'd only be one person on the ball's path that can block it. We shall see.
|
|
|
Post by wyvernxk7 on Jun 7, 2013 8:18:57 GMT -8
Both of TME's wins came with WIDE, I think; it's a position for two strong shooters as Forwards and one strong passer as a center.
|
|
|
Post by countlieberkuhn on Jun 7, 2013 10:01:00 GMT -8
Magic Missiles are actually faring pretty well! I really mixed things up formation-wise in the last game, and tried to put all of the aggressive players in there. Even one of the defenders had an above-average shooting score. I'm liking how versatile they are - they don't win much, but now that I'm understanding the dynamics of the new program a bit more and seeing how other teams play, I can effectively build them to counter most teams now, I think. SM7 is surprising me with their top-dog status right now though, especially as I didn't build them with pure shooting power - not even Jecht. Most of the forwards can handle themselves in a brawl, which I think is making them able to maintain pressure on the enemy goal more effectively. A much smaller percentage go through, but they get more chances, so I think the stats are pretty balanced in this regard. So far the only team they've lost against are my other team, so that makes me feel pretty good New team positions will come either tonight or tomorrow, Bob!
|
|