|
Post by Bob on Apr 14, 2013 17:35:47 GMT -8
This thread is for general comments about TGP Blitzball.
|
|
|
Post by Bob on Apr 17, 2013 19:41:39 GMT -8
Howdy folks! I'm hoping people can start to peek into the registration page and sign their teams up soon. So far, only Wyvern and I have put in our teams. I'd really like a single directory for team lists. I had to look through several pages to find them since they're kinda buried. Also, I'd kinda like to see who's actively ready to participate in blitzball, so please post your teams up.
Thanks, ya'll!
|
|
|
Post by countlieberkuhn on Apr 18, 2013 6:13:28 GMT -8
I'm not sure if its just that my two teams are really evenly matched, but I've simmed the match 5 times now and it always ends in a 0-0 tie Looking at it, nobody ever seems to shoot. I'm not sure if its because they're all constantly locking horns in the middle, or if something else is afoot. For reference, one team is using a normal formation, and the other is using wide.
|
|
|
Post by Bob on Apr 18, 2013 17:33:47 GMT -8
Could be that they're evenly matched. I might continue to play with functions to see if things work better, but we'll see. What's likely happening is the players are never expecting to make any shots. If they think they can't make a shot, they don't take it. That's what the HIGH NORMAL and LOW risk is all about. Try changing a few forwards to HIGH risk and see if they take a shot. You can change it back, but that will at least help us figure out why they're not shooting.
|
|
|
Post by countlieberkuhn on Apr 18, 2013 18:05:13 GMT -8
Some of them were XD Jecht is an all in kinda guy.
|
|
|
Post by Bob on Apr 18, 2013 18:30:01 GMT -8
Heh, I'd figure he would be.
Well hell, I dunno. I think I need to play with equations to find a good balance for SHT and CA. Blitzball is kind of a broken concept. Although....
...Dare I say?
...Hell, why not. Okay, I'm CONSIDERING including passive abilities in the program (Oh no he di'n't!). It's an idea I've been contemplating for a while now where whatever the package each character has the most levels in becomes their passive skill.
FOR INSTANCE!
Brawler will allow them to be involved in encounters from a farther distance. Elite Defense will allow them to spot the ball carrier from farther away. Tackle Slip will give them a significantly higher chance to slip a tackle (it's currently 1/10, I think. 1/20 chance to outright slip and 1/20 chance to slip but become disoriented). Grip Gloves could make the chance for goalies to catch the ball higher. Probably wouldn't increase the CA stat at all, but might make it so that they'll never (or very, very rarely) only block the ball (meaning no more "loose ball" situation). Golden Arm will decrease the ball drag (these should all sound pretty familiar...).
Anywho, the tricky ones would be Jecht Shot, Volley Shot, and All-Rounder. I'm considering making Jecht Shot a simple "+X to SHT" or something like that.
Volley Shot I'm considering doing like actual blitzball volley shot, but that's such a crappy ability. Decent enough if you get on a loose ball right next to the opponent's goalie, but otherwise you end up shooting from too dang far away. Plus, if the goalie has Grip Gloves, then hell if HE'S only blocking it.
All-Rounder is the biggest head-scratcher since it's not an actual blitzball move, like the rest are. Could just be a simple stat booster, I guess. +1 to all stats" or something like that.
Finally, what might be really interesting (and kind of a game-changer) is that we could say that they gain these moves even if their highest abilities are TIED. Meaning, if you put 5 into Golden Arm and 5 into Tackle Slip, then you'll have decreased ball drag AND increased chance to slip tackles. It might encourage people to divide up their stats more evenly (dunno if that's a good thing or not yet...). Then somebody MIGHT have only 2 in each package, but they'll have five different abilities. And what'd be delightfully funny about that is that when they level up, they're bound to lose four abilities.
Just an idea I've been tossing around in my head, but thinking that maybe abilities would make this game more interesting.
|
|
|
Post by Bob on Apr 20, 2013 13:40:34 GMT -8
......Oh boy. Found a HUGE programming error. This is probably why things are kinda crazy. I made a few test teams and found that Cloud (on my Avalanche test team) was not shooting, despite being IN THE FRIGGIN GOAL and having a shot of over 50! Turns out, if a player broke the defenders, they uhh....kinda wouldn't do anything. So as long as a defender was nearby, they would never shoot. This is a HUGE catch. So...yeah. Program revision on the way!
While I work on revising that though, I had another idea for the program that I'm curious if you guys think you'd like. It's the Shot Bonus. I'm thinking we make a bonus where each time the ball carrier either survives a tackle (each tackle) or throws a completed pass (and avoids a block), they get a global +1 SHT for their team. And this bonus continues to add up and up and up until...they lose the ball. Once the other team steals the ball or blocks a shot or whatever, the bonus is reset.
Basically, it gives a huge benefit for teams that are just able to hold the ball. Whether they pass or survive shots, they will build up this bonus. I think it allows even crappy shooters to make a shot, you just need to actually hold the ball that long.
What do you guys think?
|
|
|
Post by wyvernxk7 on Apr 20, 2013 15:39:56 GMT -8
That's kinda a neat dynamic... I do worry that continuing to try to complicate things further will just delay the game inevitably, and when the program has yet to function 100% properly, it seems like that should be the main focus.
|
|
|
Post by Bob on Apr 20, 2013 16:03:09 GMT -8
It is the main focus, yeah. I just know shooting is an issue, so I tried programming it in. It looks like things are 100% functional now, but I am noticing that the Wide formation is a TERRIBLE idea. Most of the game is played in the middle (-3 < y < 3), so anybody outside it (Wide formation) isn't really engaging. So uhh, user beware. I suppose there's the chance that on Wide formation, your forwards would be hard to reach since people are generally outside the main area, but so far, my tests are showing that Wide = bad.
Right now, my focus is on making the program more user-friendly, but it looks like it's working. I made it so that players can spot the ball-carrier faster because they were seeing them too late and never catching up, so I increased it from a radius of 3 to 7 and it seems a lot more responsive. So...yeah. Program's ready. I'll see if I can make it work better on your end, but I'm having no difficulties simming successful matches.
|
|
|
Post by wyvernxk7 on Apr 20, 2013 16:24:47 GMT -8
As far as the pack incentives go, they could be pretty cool.
I love the multi-passive idea, because of the way it can change the character development strategies.
For the Jecht Shot passive, maybe you'd want it to have a 20% chance of being unchallengeable by anyone other than the goalie (for instance, if the Jecht striker has four defenders swarming him and he gets the passive, it don't mean squat what their block is, 'cause they ain't touchin' it! But perhaps when receiving the bonus, their pass shot would be hindered by a certain degree (somewhere between 20 and 50%?).
The volley shot... Hm... maybe when the player gets the ball, there's a chance (1/3?) that 25% of their endurance will be converted to SHT (for instance, a player with 24END and 15SHT might end up having only 18END and 21SHT during their possession.)
As you can see, I'm trying to think of ways to make it not just a bonus, but something you really need to consider. For instance, when you make a character in Fallout New Vegas, you can determine a trait for them from the get-go, which gives an additional bonus to one facet but hinders another (a simpler example would be Pokemon's nature system). That way, it would make multi-passives something to really be careful about.
Grip gloves could have a small (no greater than 5%) chance of the goalie essentially completely failing to even have a chance at catching the ball (CA=1 or something).
Still thinking about other balancing counter-incentives.
|
|
|
Post by Bob on Apr 20, 2013 16:32:33 GMT -8
I did realize the other day that sometimes in FFX, it says "Blahblah couldn't block it." I don't have anything like that in my code, though I do have a small tackle slip. Maybe I'll include that, then Jecht Shot (like Tackle Slip) will just give an increased chance of that happening.
Volley Shot is still a toughie. I don't really want to touch stats, so...I dunno. I was thinking that maybe if a pass is made to a player within X distance of the goal, they'll do an alley-oop or a give-and-go where they automatically shoot the ball. That'd be tricky to code though. And by tricky, I mean it'd take more effort than most of these other things.
I could always just make a quick ability for each player to pick between, too. My biggest problem with doing this is that it could alter what stats we pick. So I'm iffy on all of this, especially since I'd really like to start playing soon and adding on something like this that changes the game dynamic isn't something I think we want to do after creating teams, y'know?
What about the Shot Bonus idea? I've already implemented that in my new code and it works well, but what do you guys think about the concept?
|
|
|
Post by wyvernxk7 on Apr 20, 2013 16:35:09 GMT -8
Yeah - maybe if we should do any of it, it should just be the shot bonuses. At this stage in the game, I'd like the games to actually be happening - just something to consider for the future.
|
|
|
Post by Bob on Apr 20, 2013 17:24:13 GMT -8
And I have it functioning now! There's a version 2 out that is (hopefully) MUCH more user-friendly and has removed those errors you two have been having...I hope. So download it and give it a try! forum.goatpen.org/Blitzball/ForumBlitzV2.exe
|
|
|
Post by Bob on Apr 20, 2013 22:14:59 GMT -8
Okay, I think I have the bugs out, but I don't know that I fixed anything. Still, I like the output. It kinda shows off somebody's shot power without outright saying it. Functionality is good, user-friendly and the like, so...test it out! I think we can start the league up finally!
|
|
|
Post by Fleck on Apr 20, 2013 23:03:25 GMT -8
Okay, ran some tests and here's what I'm seeing: When I first started playing with Version 2, I was still having the same problems. I was just about to give up, when I remembered something Gabe said about putting the different teams on different lines, instead of having it all on one string. I did so, and that seems to have corrected the issues I was complaining about before. However, now I have 2 new problems. Problem 1 = Just got finished simming 12 matches, alternating home/away. Home won 8 of the 12, with 2 tie games. Note that all my teams are identical, except for the Commies who have the variable risk factors. Everyone else is copy/paste. Problem 1 could possibly be explained by just random chance, since the numbers are low enough. Except for the fact that... ... Problem 2 = I am occasionally getting ABSOLUTE DOMINATION GAMES. Two of the games I simmed finished 20-0. Both went in favor of the home team. There were a couple 7-0 games as well. In the super blowout games, the first person to touch the ball would immediately shoot and score almost every time. www.darksarcasm.goatpen.org/images/Blitz/My current teamdata and playerdata files, plus an example of one of the blowout games, this one ending 14-0. I have no theories to offer.
|
|